Joined: Oct 19, 2009 Posts: 35 Location: Australia
Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:24 pm Post subject: A witch that cannot curse, cannot heal.
The other weekend I was away visiting friends in a seaside town, which just happened to be holding a pagan festival of sorts. As in the way of such things, there were several “workshops” on offer and one in particular focused considerably on this phrase “a witch that cannot curse, cannot heal”, admittedly within a decidedly Wiccan context, at least to my mind anyway.
All of which lead me to thinking about this phrase and its other such variations and how it is bandied about ad nauseam. I wonder where this phrase would sit within traditional witchcraft, or whether it has been of practical use to anyone? What relevance does it have for you……as in your own interpretation and does it relate to your practice, tradition, experience?
My interpretation has been a somewhat literal one, that a witch without the authority/determination to command or curse the spirit of disease from a patient, will be unable to heal.
I suspect that there may be as many differing interpretations as there are witches.
Joined: Aug 17, 2007 Posts: 124 Location: North Central Tennessee
Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:00 pm Post subject: A witch that cannot
I see it as it's interpretation is to do whatever that's essential to get the job/working/whatever done, it the extremes that this refers to , I have seen it phraised as , cannot kill , cannot heal . Sometimes you have to crack eggs to get to the inside...
My $.02
Joined: Aug 11, 2005 Posts: 1198 Location: Pembrokeshire, West Wales.
Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:38 pm Post subject: Re: A witch that cannot curse, cannot heal.
Sunna wrote:
The other weekend I was away visiting friends in a seaside town, which just happened to be holding a pagan festival of sorts. As in the way of such things, there were several “workshops” on offer and one in particular focused considerably on this phrase “a witch that cannot curse, cannot heal”, admittedly within a decidedly Wiccan context, at least to my mind anyway.
All of which lead me to thinking about this phrase and its other such variations and how it is bandied about ad nauseam. I wonder where this phrase would sit within traditional witchcraft, or whether it has been of practical use to anyone? What relevance does it have for you……as in your own interpretation and does it relate to your practice, tradition, experience?
My interpretation has been a somewhat literal one, that a witch without the authority/determination to command or curse the spirit of disease from a patient, will be unable to heal.
I suspect that there may be as many differing interpretations as there are witches.
I don't think that "curse" and "heal" are very compatible opposite terms really, especially within the context that you've outlined in your healing example above - that healing within itself requires destruction in order to make way for growth. The process of "healing" would indeed also encompass the process of destruction and dissolution.
Unfortunately, words like "heal" or "healing" and the processes implied have been tainted by new-age perceptions and such whereby anything coming under it is considered solely "good" and "nice" - hence why the two terms in the phrase of the subject matter are superficially incompatible in my view.
I heard a story once whereby someone with cancer went for Reiki treatment in the hope of eradicating it. Instead, the "healing" treatment sought the best route to recovery and relief, which was an acceleration of the cancer and bodily death. Healing, cursing, or just nature?
It is also of interest that the term "curse" may be related to the Latin "cursus", meaning "course".
Witch is alligned to nature, and within that inherent nature are equal forces of creation and destruction, of expansion and contraction - and will act according to that allignment - and will do what needs to be done when and where it is required if the choice is made to do so, with full responsibility taken for that choice and in light of possible consequences.
There is a wisest action or inaction concealed in every situation in life, which is devoid of conditioned perceptions and egoic-fantasies of the self-righteous "good" or "bad" opinions of the prevailing society, religion and culture. The intelligences and processes of nature take this course of action and so do those alligned to that nature. We walk upon a crooked path.
There are no "two sides of the same coin", when we ARE the coin. Take everything as it comes and deal with it accordingly, tempered with wisdom and awareness.
Joined: Dec 10, 2006 Posts: 2352 Location: N.Wales
Posted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 12:36 am Post subject: Re: A witch that cannot curse, cannot heal.
Sunna wrote:
I wonder where this phrase would sit within traditional witchcraft, or whether it has been of practical use to anyone? What relevance does it have for you……as in your own interpretation and does it relate to your practice, tradition, experience?
My interpretation has been a somewhat literal one, that a witch without the authority/determination to command or curse the spirit of disease from a patient, will be unable to heal.
Hmm..In response to the 2nd part of the quote, and relating it to the 'curse/heal adage', does it refer to ability or the mindset/willingness to do it in the first place? Was this person trying to dispel the illusion that Wiccans will only heal and not curse? If referring to ability then I can relate to this- healing and cursing, as Owl so rightly said,are intrinsically linked. All our actions are, and to attempt to categorize all our actions into neat little boxes, with moral tags attached, simply won't work. The effects are far reaching, as are the consequences - A 'curse' might have an effect on subject No1, but it freed person No2 from their situation.
Owl mentioned 'course' and 'curse' as possible origin and result of word. My initial instinct was 'run it's course', almost suggest that a curse is simply a situation that reaches a logical conclusion, for balance to be achieved I suppose. If I follow this train of thought I think that a curse sums up Witch trying to change situations..maybe originally 'curse' formed
as a word to describe those who were trying to change situations and therefore contra Churchie doctrine and therefore God. _________________ The real voyage of discovery consists not in seeing new landscapes, but in having new eyes - Marcel Proust
Last edited by woodwose on Wed Mar 10, 2010 3:37 pm; edited 2 times in total
Well, the whole of a witch's powers are phrased variously, but something like:
"the power to send and the power to fetch, the power to blast and the power to bless"
But I'd say that the source for all power is impartial, so the idea that one must be able to curse as well as bless is simply that one must have power in order to have power, a tautology, as power can always be used for different ends. The point, surely, is knowing the difference.
Perhaps a medical metaphor would work, since the word 'heal' is being bandied about. A physician learns the intimate workings of the human body, what makes it go, what can go wrong, and how to fix problems. That knowledge gives her a tremendous amount of power, which is neither 'good' nor 'bad' by itself, that she (typically) uses to heal patients. The same knowledge could be used to render someone ill, or to kill--it's a matter of what the doctor chooses to do.
As Owl pointed out, 'healing' may not actually involve the eradication of the disease. And even if it does, the cure may sometimes seem worse than the disease, at least for a time. A bone may need to be rebroken so it can be set properly.
Hob _________________ "It is not the answer that enlightens, but the question." -- Eugene Ionesco
I agree with Stuart; you have to have power to have power. If you ignore that dark side of things, you really are ignoring reality and life. You're not a well-rounded person, and you're limiting your advancement. Now, am I saying you should curse some people just so you can heal others? No, but I am saying that you at least need to be aware of HOW you would do it. If nothing else, you need to know the workings and signs of negative magic, so if you should ever come across its effects, you'll recognize the signs and (hopefully) know how to reverse it.
I've also heard the concept that it's easier to work out of anger than out of more altruistic motivations. This person (and I will try and find the reference) claimed that as a Witch, if you can't work magic from the very powerful emotions of rage and vindictiveness, what hope do you have to work it from the much-less-intense ones like kindness? To just look at one side of the coin (as do the much-maligned "love and light" crowd) is to miss the big picture. I think a big part, for me, of being a Witch is learning how to control all aspects of myself, including the less-than-nice ones.
Joined: Oct 13, 2008 Posts: 36 Location: Spokane, Washington
Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 6:57 am Post subject:
Wassail!
"The sword that brings death, brings life."
Witches are as two-faced as their Father. This is not to be taken as a rude statement, of course. A balance must be kept within our lives, I feel. There is both Light and Darkness inherent within us all. If we, as workings of the Cunning Flame, can not use it to bring ruin to the enemies of our People then we can not use It to protect our loved ones.
We must have complete knowledge of It all or else how do we know how to use It when the situation calls? The problem with this new-age "We must love everyone and turn the other cheek" nonsense is that we lose a very important side of our Selves and our Craft. The knowing of curses is the most powerful aspect of Witch Lore. So too is their power to heal the Land and bring the rains and such things.
If we forget the cursing then we forget an entire aspect of our Self. And both healing and cursing take a large amount of energy and time. And of course they will only be fulfilled if Fate wills it.
Wassail and Frith,
Angus. _________________ I drink to th' Devil and th' Dame and dance with th' spirits 'til Church Bells ring.
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